Transcript of podcast episode with alumni guest speaker, Tianhao He.
Podcast length: 38:43
Cate: Welcome everyone to the newest edition of Career Talk. My name is Cate Linforth, I’m the International Employee Liaison Officer here at Careers Network at the University of Birmingham. I am really excited because today we are joined by Tianhao He, who is one of our graduates from the University of Birmingham. Welcome Tianhao, how are you?
Tian: Yeah I’m fine, thank you.
Cate: Thank you so much for joining us. Can you just tell us a little bit about yourself, where you're from, what you studied at UoB and what your current job is?
Tian: Okay, so I come from China and I came to the UK roughly more than ten years ago. I spent four years at Birmingham University for my PhD studies with the Electronic and Computer Science Engineering School. I think it's now merged into the Engineering School. I studied about Microwave Engineering. I learned how to design tests and fabricate the microwave communication systems.
After that, after 2015 I joined BT the company I’m currently working for, as a Network Planning Specialist. So I’m looking after the whole of BT’s network, with some focus on the core network. BT has played an important role, especially during the difficult time of COVID, to get everyone connected, to enable them to work from home and get connected with other friends and relatives.
Cate: Definitely, now more than ever we rely so heavily on the internet and on technology to keep in touch with family who we aren't able to see still because of travel, to keep in touch during business meetings. It wasn't that long ago that, even at the university, we weren't regularly doing video meetings or webinars and things like that. I think the pandemic has really forced that, but it's brought about a lot of positive change, so I imagine you've been really busy over the last few years.
Tian: Yeah, the BT broadband is not just the only products we have. We have the national infrastructure for the whole network, but that's come with a lot of different operators, which means other operators depend on BT’s network to operate their own business, their own telecomms. What I feel proud of is that it is quite a critical infrastructure to get the things moving. It has provided infrastructure for the 999 and for the NHS as well.
Cate: Oh wow, so it is completely critical and required for this country to run effectively. So, broadly speaking, what does your role involve on a day-to-day basis?
Tian: Okay, my day-to-day basis is about the capacity plan. The mobile broadband has emerged quite large and more people enjoy using more of the data, rather than sending text messages or making phone calls. Capacity requirements has been increased dramatically. More and more people are consuming the data, so we need to look after the capacity we have to meet the requirement and try to minimize the cost, because the infrastructure costs money and the electricity costs money and we have a huge cost increase of the electricity. So, it’s trying to balance the demands of the capacity and minimize the cost to have the best business benefits.
Cate: Interesting. So, from people who aren't involved in that or aren't within that field we really obviously just take for granted the fact that we can just pick up our phone and start using our data and that unlimited data, but I guess even over the last few years alone that data usage will have gone up astronomically compared to what it was both pre pandemic, but also, with the evolution of smartphones being much more capable as well. I think it sounds it sounds like such an important job.
Tian: It's so important. Communications is like a utility, it’s like your electricity, your gas and your water, now it’s the broadband.
Cate: We’d be lost without it.
Tian: It is so fundamental and you don't notice. You only notice us when you don't have access to that.
Cate: And then people get really angry. So then, when you were studying, when you went to university, both for your undergraduate your postgrad, and when you were doing your PhD, what did you envisage you would do as a job, did you did you want to go into this line of work? I know you said that you said that you were studying more microwave systems, what were you hoping to do after your studies or did you have a clear path?
Tian: In my bachelor’s degree, where I studied at Liverpool University, I studied about telecommunications. Then, I moved more into the hardware design with the University of Birmingham. It’s different, but it still covered the whole range of the telecom industry, so it's the IT industry. Then after my finished my study, I think that BT is one of the best company to work for because that was the biggest company in UK for telecom. It probably is still now the biggest one.
Cate: Definitely, and I mean, everyone that gets internet put into their house has to have a BT line. It’s kind of everywhere.
When you were studying, did you always know that you wanted to stay in the UK or were you planning on returning to China or going elsewhere, what were your plans when you were studying?
Tian: When I joined my research in Birmingham University, I do have strong ambitions to stay in the UK, to have more work experience in the UK. So I came to the Careers Fairs of the University Birmingham in the first year of my degree. So I’m trying to understand the difference of the sectors and the different job opportunities.
Cate: I think that's really that's really important to touch upon as well because you're familiar with Careers Network and what we have available and so many students wait until the end of their studies to start thinking about their career prospects or their career plans. A lot of people will spend the majority of their studies focusing on their studies, which obviously is very important, but then they don't focus on their career until the very end, and they missed out on a lot of these opportunities. For instance, like you say the career fairs most of them tend to happen in Autumn term. So for students that are here just doing a Masters, if they're only here for one year, you have to hit the ground running. I think you were very wise to start from early on and looking at different sectors and exploring your options and seeing what was available.
I’m guessing that you would have originally stayed on a tier two sponsorship visa, is that right?
Tian: Yeah.
Cate: How did you find that process in terms of finding a company that would sponsor you and going through the visa process, did you find it difficult or did you feel it as though it was relatively straightforward because you were so skilled and specialist in your studies?
Tian: I think it's quite straightforward for the company to do this process but it's not straightforward for students looking for jobs. Now most companies adopt some application form to say if you need the sponsorship. When I applied for jobs, there was not those options as much, so I have to ask them, the companies, if they are willing to sponsor any visa. If they say no, I just ignore any of the applications, that saved me a lot of time.
Cate: I think it's difficult as well, because some companies have the sponsorship license and they're technically able to sponsor but, as a matter of course don't necessarily go through the sponsorship process, unless it is for an exceptional candidate and unless they know that a candidate is worth it, or is exceptional, they're not willing to commit to whether or not they would sponsor. I’d imagine that when you're going through that process, it's incredibly stressful trying to find companies that will sponsor, and then going through the whole application process and everything.
Did you find that application process different to what you were expecting or is there anything that, as an international student, you found was more difficult than you were expecting or was different to how it would have been had you been applying back home?
Tian: I think for the job application process, it's like a standard way so anyone to apply for a job will be the same. But sometimes you have the option to tick if you need the visa sponsorship or not. After all those interviews, then the tricky part is how the company will work with you to get your visa sponsored. That's the tricky part and it has to be carefully looked after.
Cate: I’m guessing that BT as a really large company would have had a dedicated person or team, and it would have been something that they were familiar with and willing to go through that process to make sure that it was all above board.
Tian: The large corporations have a dedicated extra team working on those visa issues. They usually outsource those visa application processes to immigration companies and usually they will pay for that.
Cate: Great. Just going back a little bit to the recruitment process itself, did you find it very stressful or was there any element of it that you found more difficult than you were expecting or surprising? Firstly, what were the stages, did you have your traditional initial interview, maybe a second interview and then an assessment centre?
Tian: I think for standard new recruitment, they usually have an application form with CV and then go through some tests and then telephone interview and then maybe the assessment centre. What I don't like the most is online test, because it can be very stressful. For some of the numerical comprehension tests, it’s very difficult.
Cate: I think some companies are moving away from those. I think some companies maybe use them as a way to weed out applicants. But personally I think sometimes that might be a little bit short sighted because, I guess they all have to narrow down candidates in some way, but it's frustrating for the applicant because it's often difficult to see why it's relevant to the role that you'll be doing or it doesn't give you an opportunity to really showcase your skills as such.
Tian: Yeah that's some of the methods companies used to scrape out application.
Cate: Yeah, and I mean we do have that the university, there are there are programmes that you can use and an online tools and everything to help prepare you for those psychometric testing and everything. Did you use any tools like that, did you find any resources online or within the careers department to help prep you for that process, or were you going into it blind?
Tian: I purposely picked the companies that don't ask me to do online tests.
Cate: That’s very clever.
Tian: Because I have tried several times and didn't do that well because I don’t have the ambition or the time to do the practice. I do find that Careers Network has provided valuable help on CVs, mock interviews and application forms to improve my job application’s English. I think that has made me stand out.
Cate: I think that's really important that CVs and the type of writing and vocabulary that you would use in a job application or in your resume is often very different to spoken English. But it's also the formats are very different all over the world. What you would expect in the US versus the UK is really different, what you would expect in China is very different. So I think it's really important for all students to take advantage of the services in terms of making sure that your CV is ready and things like that, but also especially international students to make sure that you aren't missing out on opportunities, because of a small grammatical issue or just a phrase that may be slightly different and things like that, that would be forgiven in spoken English but is less so in written.
Like I was saying about the testing, employers will often get thousands and thousands of applications, so a lot of employers will run CVs through a programme to get rid of any that have errors or aren't in the right format so it's particularly important for international students to make sure that they're going into it with the best opportunity available and getting CVs ready. I know some areas of the institution are suggesting to prospective students, before they come, that the one thing they can do before they start university is have a go at writing their CV, so that when they start at the university and when they are going to those first careers appointments, they've at least got a CV to show and something to work with. I think things like that are really important.
Did you have any one-to-one careers advice appointments and things like that, whilst you were here?
Tian: Yes, I used to service a lot when I doing to the job applications occasions at the end of the year of my study. Usually I booked several times a month with CV checking and there are some workshops in the Careers Network, I tried to book most of them just to get familiar with the process.
Cate: That's great and you're our dream student because you were so proactive and you knew that in order to have the best opportunities it's really important to make the most of your time and really inform yourself about all of the resources that are available and like you say you booked several times. We don't have a set amount of resources, you can't just take advantage of one thing. We have lots of opportunities to get involved with Careers Network.
Tian: I think it's a win-win situation for students to go to Careers Network, or those employment services, which means like students can get more familiar and confidence about job application and it can keep the Careers Network people busy, which means we have strong demand for students to have those services, which means the Careers Network can grow the teams. Also, employment and alumni careers will increase the university’s reputation.
Cate: Definitely, it's a cycle, and I think the more that students know about the services that are available, the more that they'll engage with them and so that's what we try and do within Careers. We're available at lots of different points, either within the college or centrally with the career fairs. Some people think of career services as just help with a job application and a career fair but we offer so many other ways to get involved.
I’m interested to hear about where you looked for jobs, did you search for jobs, were there job boards in particular? Did you use Careers Connect at the university, was it mainly through the career fairs that you found out about what positions were available? How did you find out about and what companies were hiring and roles that you were interested in?
Tian: Okay, careers fairs is quite an important one. When I joined BT I do this and come back with the university twice to present as the career fair and give back. Also, Indeed and LinkedIn are quite important websites for understanding the job market as well.
Cate: Did you network during your time at university, did you go to any events and try and meet people from the companies or were you more focused on honing your application skills?
Tian: Sometimes I networked with people, but not like to wish to know some people who can introduce me to a company. The most useful for me is to know some people in that industry, so I can understand the industrial sector better.
Cate: I think that's really key, especially when you're looking at applying for jobs in a particular or sector within a particular company. If you know someone within that company or within that sector that can give you some insight into what actually happens, or what the company culture is like or what the day to day is like. All of that information helps you when you go to your application and your interviews, because it shows that you've actually done your research and it shows that you understand what you would be getting yourself in for if you were to get a job in that in that company.
It sounds like you were really well prepared for the whole application process and the getting the job aspect. How did you find that transition from university to working? Was it as expected, was there anything that you found particularly tricky going from being a full time student to a full time employee? What was your experience?
Tian: I think that some differences are when I studied as a full time student, I mostly worked on my own. The operations of creations, most of the projects you've done in a team, so the teamwork has be crucial, and the communication skills and how to communicate and work with different people have played more important role than studying in university, because you study your university in lab or you sit an exam, you’re mostly on your own. But working in corporations, you work with a lot of people and you need to know people, and you can get them help.
Cate: I think that's really important and that's why we offer things like consultancy challenges and boot camps on campus and opportunities for students to participate in group either challenges, or mini internships or competitions, because it helps hone those softer skills that are really important to employers and being able to work well in a team and being adaptable and resilient and a critical thinker and a problem solver are all really important skills that, while you do learn a lot of those things whilst you're studying, I guess, some of them, the degree programs where you work more independently, you need those skills. So we try and offer those in lots of different ways.
Did you engage with societies or anything else you were studying, were you involved in any extracurriculars or any part time jobs or societies?
Tian: I don't work with societies, but I do work with Worklink.
Cate: What did you do while you were working?
Tian: I did all kinds of part time jobs with university and mostly with university itself, like our closely with the Careers Network. I think there was an event called poster conference, that's was an interesting one. I spent some time working in our small restaurants in the universe center for several days and that was an interesting experience. So I do have some restaurant work experience.
Cate: Those are really good experiences though, because even though they're not necessarily related to the career field that you were going into, any experience is a good thing to add to your CV because they show that they show those kinds of softer skills like teamwork and communication and adaptability and the fact that you would have had lots of shorter part time job shows that you have that versatility. Those are all things that employers are looking for because a lot of companies, there are niche technical elements that are relevant only to that company and so they're happy to train people on those, but it's also the softer skills and the more personality based skills that they need to be inherent within you. So those are all things that students can get while they're studying , on top of your studies to engage.
Tian: I think it's important for international students to spend time working some part time jobs in like English working settings so they can improve their speaking and listening skills and improve their confidence, working with English people, or I mean English speaking people, because the language can be the biggest challenge when for looking for jobs and attending those interviews.
Cate: Definitely, and I think you make a good point about confidence as well. I think a lot of students have a very, very exceptional command of English language, international students do. They have to, to come here to study, but I think it's that confidence of putting yourself out there and speaking in front of other people or widening your social circles and getting to know lots of people from lots of different countries as well, all broadens your perspective and gives you that confidence. I think in terms of language skills, the UK in particular for such a small country has so many vastly different accents as well. I mean even English being my first language, I’m not from the UK and I still struggle occasionally with very strong UK accents, so I think the more experience you can have with lots of different accents and lots of different people is going to help you in that application process when you need to showcase your linguistic skills.
Going back to what your current role, do you have any advice for students who are currently studying that are looking to get into the telecommunications sector in terms of what they can do to make themselves more hirable, or what they can do to do more research into the area?
Tian: I think if students can do some internships, that can make people really stand out and especially when their experience can show some work experience in that industry.
Cate: I think that's a really good point and I think also we're hearing, it's not a secret that a lot of companies will hire from their internship pools as well. They'll offer graduate placement so it's an opportunity for a student to have an extended interview, if you will, over several weeks to really showcase who they are, as an individual, and what they're capable of, and whether or not they fit within the company culture, so I think it's really important to take advantage.
Tian: It’s also important for students working in the industry to understand if they really want to work in ths company and this industry, because it’s a two-way interview. The company is looking to see if you fit for the job, you should look to see if the company fits for your purpose.
Cate: I couldn't have said it any better, and I think also sometimes students forget that or they don't put as much emphasis on the fact that they're also interviewing a company to decide if it's somewhere that they would feel comfortable working or if it's an industry that they actually want to work in. I think often, it's very different learning about something than it is working within that area and practice and it's really important, we spend so much of our lives that work, it's really important to be somewhere that you feel comfortable and that you have a good fit and it makes you more successful as well if you're in a job that you like, in a company that you enjoy and that you feel is a good cultural fit for you, you're more likely to do well in that environment than you are if you're somewhere that you don't feel comfortable.
Do you think there are many options for UK educated international students within your organization, or within the telecommunications industry?
Tian: I think so. Those telecoms companies are still open for all applications. Especially also the PSW programme has given the company more flexibility visa options, which is good news for international students.
Cate: Oh it's fantastic, the new graduate route visa has really opened up doors for so many international students who wanted to stay in the UK and at least have an opportunity to work in the UK a little bit, either before returning to their home country or as a trial to see if it's somewhere that they wanted to stay longer term. So that graduate route takes a little bit of pressure off students and gives them an opportunity and it takes some of the pressure off of employers as well because students are able to apply for that visa and the onus isn't as much on the employer to take a leap of faith on new hires.
What do you think and the biggest challenges right now are for your industry? I know you already mentioned the rapid expansion of data usage and just generally the infrastructure and the usage of telecommunications and also the increase in energy prices and trying to keep costs down. Do you think those are the biggest challenges currently facing telecommunications?
Tian: In terms of most of the companies, the biggest trickiest is about the cost management. So we need to minimize costs while we keep our core operations running. That's one thing. Also, especially for telecoms, the cyber security has been quite important and is the true critical infrastructure to help keep people connected, it is scary, it is quite a challenging.
Cate: I think data security and will only get more important with the more that people keep online, in terms of all of our banking data and all of our personal data, and you have all these companies collecting big data as well. It's really important that we as a society, but also large corporations, in particular, are able to guarantee some level of protection of data as well.
What's the biggest reward that you get out of your job and aside from salary, obviously?
Tian: It's kind of the achievements, because you know your daily work makes difference or makes impact on other people. You get people connected, you get the hospital connected, you get 999 connected, you get the whole country connected.
Cate: I think that's really, really critical to say. You're not just sitting behind a desk doing your job and not seeing the product of it, everywhere you look you're seeing the results from your work every. Anywhere you go where there is a connectivity anywhere, hospitals, you see, literally, helping people save lives and that's, I would imagine, a really fulfilling aspect of your career.
Tian: Yeah. I think probably people won't notice if you have power cut, but people will notice if they have an electricity cut or you lost your Wi-Fi.
Cate: It's so true. People get angry when they lose their Wi-Fi because everyone is so used to just having it and it just being there. I think if ever there is a network cut off at work, or anyone else ,suddenly it's like well there's nothing to do, because everything that everyone does is online these days.
Tian: Yeah and also the tricky thing is how people use electricity don't change that much. If you have one refrigerator today, you won't have ten refrigerators tomorrow. Or in one year, you still probably have one or two. You have a very slow incremental use of electricity, but for your mobile phone or broadband, you consume much more data, you use more different internet services, and you have more connected devices, like the smartphone, or smart homes. So that's gives potential challenging for telecoms to managing those capacity.
Cate: I’m probably showing my age here, but I remember when I first got a smartphone and ‘I thought I’m not going to use this for the Internet’, and I would use it obviously to send maybe a WhatsApp message, so that was using Internet, but I would never open up a browser. Whereas now, most of the time, if I need to know something I’ll check my phone and go on to Google on my phone. If you think just that personal usage has gone up and everyone has an app for everything now, there's not only home heating systems, but one of my light bulbs at home has an app for it to change the color of light bulb, so everything is connected and everything is online. It is incredibly important to be able to stay connected to just manage your life these days. So I think what you're doing is really important, and I think more important than many people realize, so thank you from all of us.
Tian, I’m really conscious of your time and it's been really interesting to learn about more about the telecommunications sector, but just how ingrained what you're doing is in daily life for everyone and to hear a little bit more about your career journey.
I just have one final question if that's okay. What top tips or recommendations do you have for current international students, in terms of making the most of the time in the UK or making the most of their time at Birmingham? It can be either a personal recommendation for personal growth or it can also be making the most of your time in order to better your career prospects. What would you say is the most important thing for students to do, whilst they're here?
Tian: I think for international students who want to have some career in the UK, I think it's important to have them practice your English as much as they can. Use the Careers Network, use employment services as much as they can and apply for jobs early as they can.
Cate: That's a really good point and I think some students don't realise that when they come to the UK and they have to hit the ground running with job applications, because a lot of graduate schemes in particular will have their jobs, open from August to November maybe. If you're not starting on campus until the autumn term you really need to be getting all of that ready straight away. So, I think that's really, really good advice.
Tian, it's been wonderful to chat with you and to hear a little bit more about your experiences and thank you so much for your time and thanks for talking to me.
Tian: Okay, thank you.